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> <channel><title>Comments on: Michigan Tech University Infringes on Civil Rights</title> <atom:link href="http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /><link>http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/?utm_source=rss&#038;utm_medium=rss&#038;utm_campaign=michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights</link> <description>Politics, Technology, Humor... You know, a general waste of time.</description> <lastBuildDate>Fri, 04 Mar 2011 20:18:06 +0000</lastBuildDate> <sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod> <sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency> <generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=</generator> <item><title>By: Curious.</title><link>http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-6221</link> <dc:creator>Curious.</dc:creator> <pubDate>Fri, 04 Mar 2011 20:18:06 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/?p=183#comment-6221</guid> <description>I posted this on the Lode&#039;s website under another article regarding La Maison, however, I thought I&#039;d post it here, since I&#039;d like to hear your opinion.There are, obviously, as evidenced here, endless opinions that can be expressed regarding ethics, dark humour, etc., however, I’m particularly interested in discussing James’ previous statement regarding freedom of speech.Despite common misconceptions, freedom of speech isn’t without boundaries, and an examination of Supreme Court decisions certainly implicates La Maison’s chant as potentially culpable.Restrictions exist against speech that incites a clear and present danger, fighting words, and, obscenity. Of course, defining obscenity is problematic; however, the Supreme Court maintains a three-part test for identifying obscene language:1. Would the average person, applying the contemporary community standards, viewing the work as a whole, find the work appeals to the prurient* interest?
2. Does the work depict or describe sexual conduct in a patently offensive way?
3. Does the work taken as a whole lack serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value?[Merriam-Webster defines &#039;prurient&#039; as, &quot;marked by or arousing an immoderate or unwholesome interest or desire; especially : marked by, arousing, or appealing to sexual desire&quot;]Let’s examine La Maison’s chant according to these guidelines. Here is a transcript of the chant, as posted by a self-described “maggot”:Rat Shit, Bat Shit, Nasty Old Twat
Sixty-Nine Assholes Tied In A Knot
Eat, Suck, Fuck
Gobble, Nibble, Chew
We’re From La Maison
So hey, FUCK YOU!
(http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/)1. Would the average person, applying the contemporary community standards, viewing the work as a whole, find the work appeals to the prurient* interest?I doubt anyone would disagree that the chant is vulgar (another “maggot” describes it as such here: http://www.mtulode.com/opinion/2010/01/28/la-maison-hall-chant-banned-by-university/ – post by “Fellow Maggot”); whether it fits the definition of appealing to a prurient interest may be disputed, however.2. Does the work depict or describe sexual conduct in a patently offensive way?Although the term “fuck” has gained colloquial use in many areas of society, it is still defined as being “usually obscene,” (Merriam-Webster) and describes a sexual act in a way that is generally considered offensive.3. Does the work taken as a whole lack serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value?I would be happy to listen to anyone making a reasonable argument for La Maison’s chant having serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value. If you feel you can make that justification somehow, please, enlighten me.I concede that there may be debate regarding whether or not the chant patently fails on each of the three questions that the Supreme Court uses to define obscene and prohibited speech. I am an ardent defendant of freedom of speech, and I am extremely wary of any attempt at censorship; slippery slopes are concerning. However, as we exercise our rights to free speech, we ought to also ask the question, just because we can say something, does it mean that we should? In the case of La Maison’s chant, what is gained?</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I posted this on the Lode&#8217;s website under another article regarding La Maison, however, I thought I&#8217;d post it here, since I&#8217;d like to hear your opinion.</p><p>There are, obviously, as evidenced here, endless opinions that can be expressed regarding ethics, dark humour, etc., however, I’m particularly interested in discussing James’ previous statement regarding freedom of speech.</p><p>Despite common misconceptions, freedom of speech isn’t without boundaries, and an examination of Supreme Court decisions certainly implicates La Maison’s chant as potentially culpable.</p><p>Restrictions exist against speech that incites a clear and present danger, fighting words, and, obscenity. Of course, defining obscenity is problematic; however, the Supreme Court maintains a three-part test for identifying obscene language:</p><p>1. Would the average person, applying the contemporary community standards, viewing the work as a whole, find the work appeals to the prurient* interest?<br
/> 2. Does the work depict or describe sexual conduct in a patently offensive way?<br
/> 3. Does the work taken as a whole lack serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value?</p><p>[Merriam-Webster defines 'prurient' as, "marked by or arousing an immoderate or unwholesome interest or desire; especially : marked by, arousing, or appealing to sexual desire"]</p><p>Let’s examine La Maison’s chant according to these guidelines. Here is a transcript of the chant, as posted by a self-described “maggot”:</p><p>Rat Shit, Bat Shit, Nasty Old Twat<br
/> Sixty-Nine Assholes Tied In A Knot<br
/> Eat, Suck, Fuck<br
/> Gobble, Nibble, Chew<br
/> We’re From La Maison<br
/> So hey, FUCK YOU!<br
/> (<a
href="http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/" rel="nofollow">http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/</a>)</p><p>1. Would the average person, applying the contemporary community standards, viewing the work as a whole, find the work appeals to the prurient* interest?</p><p>I doubt anyone would disagree that the chant is vulgar (another “maggot” describes it as such here: <a
href="http://www.mtulode.com/opinion/2010/01/28/la-maison-hall-chant-banned-by-university/" rel="nofollow">http://www.mtulode.com/opinion/2010/01/28/la-maison-hall-chant-banned-by-university/</a> – post by “Fellow Maggot”); whether it fits the definition of appealing to a prurient interest may be disputed, however.</p><p>2. Does the work depict or describe sexual conduct in a patently offensive way?</p><p>Although the term “fuck” has gained colloquial use in many areas of society, it is still defined as being “usually obscene,” (Merriam-Webster) and describes a sexual act in a way that is generally considered offensive.</p><p>3. Does the work taken as a whole lack serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value?</p><p>I would be happy to listen to anyone making a reasonable argument for La Maison’s chant having serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value. If you feel you can make that justification somehow, please, enlighten me.</p><p>I concede that there may be debate regarding whether or not the chant patently fails on each of the three questions that the Supreme Court uses to define obscene and prohibited speech. I am an ardent defendant of freedom of speech, and I am extremely wary of any attempt at censorship; slippery slopes are concerning. However, as we exercise our rights to free speech, we ought to also ask the question, just because we can say something, does it mean that we should? In the case of La Maison’s chant, what is gained?</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: rfdeshon</title><link>http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-3026</link> <dc:creator>rfdeshon</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 14 Sep 2009 20:00:45 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/?p=183#comment-3026</guid> <description>&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-3010&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;@anon &lt;/a&gt;
The case you are citing involves a High School, not a college. Since college education is not compulsory and the vast majority of students attending Universities are adults, this case would likely not apply. Also, if you start limiting freedom of speech on college campuses what&#039;s next? Do you start censoring the research that students perform there if it&#039;s too challenging to the status quo? Are universities allowed to quash the speech of people who don&#039;t agree with school policy, who make political statements that don&#039;t agree with what the administrators believe, etc? Where does it end?</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a
href="#comment-3010" rel="nofollow">@anon </a><br
/> The case you are citing involves a High School, not a college. Since college education is not compulsory and the vast majority of students attending Universities are adults, this case would likely not apply. Also, if you start limiting freedom of speech on college campuses what&#8217;s next? Do you start censoring the research that students perform there if it&#8217;s too challenging to the status quo? Are universities allowed to quash the speech of people who don&#8217;t agree with school policy, who make political statements that don&#8217;t agree with what the administrators believe, etc? Where does it end?</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: rfdeshon</title><link>http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-3025</link> <dc:creator>rfdeshon</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 14 Sep 2009 18:52:57 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/?p=183#comment-3025</guid> <description>&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-3021&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;@anon &lt;/a&gt;
I said it&#039;s not hate speech. &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Hate speech&lt;/a&gt; is rigorously defined as speech meant to disparage a specific group of people, namely a minority. Hey fuck you is not hate speech, you may find it distasteful but not everyone agrees with you.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a
href="#comment-3021" rel="nofollow">@anon </a><br
/> I said it&#8217;s not hate speech. <a
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech" rel="nofollow">Hate speech</a> is rigorously defined as speech meant to disparage a specific group of people, namely a minority. Hey fuck you is not hate speech, you may find it distasteful but not everyone agrees with you.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: anon</title><link>http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-3021</link> <dc:creator>anon</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 14 Sep 2009 13:00:21 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/?p=183#comment-3021</guid> <description>umm, just curious, how can you say it&#039;s not hateful when you are saying &quot;hey, fuck you!&quot;???Just wondering if you understand what that means...</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>umm, just curious, how can you say it&#8217;s not hateful when you are saying &#8220;hey, fuck you!&#8221;???</p><p>Just wondering if you understand what that means&#8230;</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: anon</title><link>http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-3010</link> <dc:creator>anon</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 13 Sep 2009 22:21:27 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/?p=183#comment-3010</guid> <description>You are incorrect, a public institution such as a school can restrict freedoms of speech as well as other things to foster and enhance the learning environment. The Supreme Court of the US has ruled on this multiple times, look up the Bethel V. Fraser case. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bethel_School_District_v._Fraser  Obscene speech in a school setting is not supported by the 1st Amendment. I think the hall should be allowed to say their chant, but the fact of the matter is they have no legal backing to make the school allow them to, in fact the school has the law on their side.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are incorrect, a public institution such as a school can restrict freedoms of speech as well as other things to foster and enhance the learning environment. The Supreme Court of the US has ruled on this multiple times, look up the Bethel V. Fraser case. <a
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bethel_School_District_v._Fraser" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bethel_School_District_v._Fraser</a> Obscene speech in a school setting is not supported by the 1st Amendment. I think the hall should be allowed to say their chant, but the fact of the matter is they have no legal backing to make the school allow them to, in fact the school has the law on their side.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: anon</title><link>http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/2009/09/michigan-tech-university-infringes-on-civil-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-3000</link> <dc:creator>anon</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 13 Sep 2009 04:20:22 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://stealinurmegahurtz.com/?p=183#comment-3000</guid> <description>Meh, universities have never been much for free speech. Kids are routinely bounced out of state-funded institutions for saying things that are not P.C. (especially sexist or racist speech), so it wouldn&#039;t surprise me that they&#039;ve started to ban swearing too.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Meh, universities have never been much for free speech. Kids are routinely bounced out of state-funded institutions for saying things that are not P.C. (especially sexist or racist speech), so it wouldn&#8217;t surprise me that they&#8217;ve started to ban swearing too.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> </channel> </rss>
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